55–4

Conversation No. 55-4

Date: May 4, 1971
Time: 8:04 am - 10:04 am
Location: Cabinet Room

The President met with Vice President Spiro T. Agnew, John B. Connally, Hugh Scott, Robert P.
Griffin, Margaret Chase Smith, Gordon L. Allott, Norris Cotton, Milton R. Young, John G.
Tower, Gerald R. Ford, Leslie C. Arends, John B. Anderson, John J. Rhodes, Richard H. Poff,
Robert C. (“Bob”) Wilson, Barber B. Conable, Jr., Robert T. Stafford, H. Allen Smith, Frank T.
Bow, William B. Widnall, George P. Shultz, John D. Ehrlichman, Clark MacGregor, Kenneth R.
BeLieu, Herbert G. Klein, Ronald L. Ziegler, Patrick J. Buchanan, and Bryce N. Harlow

[General conversation/Unintelligible]

[A transcript of the following portion of the conversation was prepared under Court order from
December 1978 through March 1979, for Special Access [SA] 8, Ronald V. Dellums, et al., v.
James M. Powell, et al., No. 71-2271. The National Archives and Records Administration
produced this transcript. The National Archives does not guarantee its accuracy.]

Senate wives lunch
-Patricia R. (“Pat”) Nixon
-Mrs. Thomas G. Abernethy
-Thomas G. Abernethy
-Democrats
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Legislative program
-Current situation
-Connally
-Controversies
-Lockheed
-Supersonic Transport [SST]

Economy
-Unemployment
-Defense-related jobs
-Melvin R. Laird
-Pacific Northwest
-California
-SST
-Areas
-Contractors
-Lockheed aircraft problems
-Settlement
-Loss
-Defense Department
-Rolls-Royce bankruptcy
-Airbus companies
-Negotiations
-Great Britain
-Underwrite RB-211
-Rolls-Royce bankruptcy
-Contracts renegotiations
-Great Britain
-Losses
-Price rise
-Delay
-Eastern Airlines
-Trans World Airlines [TWA]
-Delta Airlines
-Air Canada
-Smaller orders
-Banks
-Provisions
-Need of government guarantee
-Additional financing required
-Great Britain
-Airlines
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-Possible bankruptcy
-Present program
-Great Britain
-Banks
-Possible government guarantee
-Banks
-Financing
-Airlines
-Cash requirements
-Possible receivership
-Factors involved
-McDonnell-Douglas
-DC-10
-Attitude
-Lockheed
-Potential business for L-1011 and DC-10
-Competition from Europe
-L-1011 engine
-Production expectations
-Government intervention
-McDonnell-Douglas
-Department of Defense
-Consequences of bankruptcy
-Number of subcontractors
-Small business
-Annual payroll
-Employment
-Subcontractors
-Impact
-Ripple effect on economy
-Plants throughout nation
-Consequences of possible receivership
-McDonnell-Douglas
-DC-10
-Employment
-Time lag
-Other airlines
-Investment in L-1011 program
-TWA
-Subcontractors
-Stockholders
-Bankruptcy
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-Necessity for loan guarantee
-Administration action
-Congress
-Procedure for message
-Banking and Currency Committee
-Connally’s recommendation
-Commerce Committee
-Procedures
-William B. Widnall
-Wright Patman
-Jurisdiction
-Treasury Department
-Banking and Currency Committee
-Patman
-Banking, Housing, and Urban Affairs Committee
-John J. Sparkman
-David H. Gambrell
-Alan Cranston
-Thomas J. McIntyre
-Prospects
-Banking and Currency Committee
-Patman
-Jurisdiction
-Democratic leadership
-Carl B. Albert
-Possible opposition to Lockheed aid
-”Doves”
-Opposition to government aid to corporations
-Penn Central situation
-McDonnell-Douglas
-General Electric [GE] impact
-SST
-Cranston
-John V. Tunney
-Gambrell
-SST
-Cross currents
-SST
-Hubert H. Humphrey
-Warren G. (“Maggie”) Magnuson
-Henry M. (“Scoop”) Jackson
-Controversy
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NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

Tape Subject Log
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-Lockheed
-Settlement of C5A
-Appropriations
-Possible action
-Timing
-Administration’s position
-Impending bankruptcy
-Defense program
-Lockheed
-Possible receivership
-Tax losses
-Banks
-Guaranteed loans
-Projections of repayment
-Orders
-Production
-House Appropriations Committee
-Repayment bill on SST and GE
-Lockheed
-GE
-Boeing
-Airlines
-Possible votes
-Public attitude
-Effect on Lockheed loan
-Impact
-Effect on recovery program
-Implications
-Connally
-Loan program
-Legislation
-West Coast
-Employment maintenance approach
-Democrats
-Labor reaction
-Lockheed problem
-Effect of bankruptcy
-Economy
-Ripple effect of insolvency
-Defense contracts
-Experimental
-Lockheed
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Tape Subject Log
(rev. 10/08)



-Needed for defense
-Environmental impact
-Steel production
-United States’ competitive position
-Japan
-United States’ competitive position
-Airplanes
-Lockheed
-McDonnell-Douglas
-Second position
-Defense contracts
-Cranston
-Tunney
-California
-”Super-doves”
-Gambrell
-Lockheed
-Labor position
-SST
-Edmund S. Muskie
-Humphrey
-Lockheed
-Labor position
-Democrats
-Special interests
-Economic impact of possible Lockheed bankruptcy
-SST
-”Know-nothings”
-Isolationism
-Lockheed
-Effect of Rolls-Royce bankruptcy
-United States’ companies abroad

Legislation
-House
-Suggested order
-Welfare reform
-John W. Byrnes
-Conable
-Ways and Means Committee
-Executive sessions
-Projected action
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NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

Tape Subject Log
(rev. 10/08)



-Level of payments
-Wilbur D. Mills
-Byrnes
-Revenue sharing
-Proposals
-Timing
-Conference
-Byrnes
-Voting
-Scheduling
-Welfare reform
-Revenue sharing
-Conable
-Mills
-Rules
-Ford
-Connection with welfare reform
-Shultz
-Mills
-Issues
-President’s position
-Federal, state responsibilities
-Payments
-President’s January 2, 1971 meeting with Byrnes and Mills
-Russell B. Long and Wallace F. Bennett
-Welfare reform
-Work requirements
-Welfare reform
-Study by unknown independent organization
-President’s speech at Governors’ conference
-Connally
-Work requirements
-Public reaction
-Work requirement issue
-Ronald W. Reagan
-Nelson A. Rockefeller
-Bill
-Purposes
-Close-rule
-Social Security reform
-Byrnes
-Bill
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NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

Tape Subject Log
(rev. 10/08)



-One-year residency requirements
-States
-Provisions
-Conable
-Pragmatic
-Mobility of welfare recipients
-States
-New York
-Housing
-Mississippi
-Arizona
-Courts
-Department of Health, Education and Welfare
-Federal involvement
-General revenue sharing bills
-Republican action
-Democratic action
-Committee action
-Bipartisan moves
-Ford’s speech at Williamsburg governors’ meeting
-Republican governors
-Mayors
-Possible Republican-sponsored bill
-Democratic-sponsored bill
-Henry S. Reuss
-Ways and Means Committee inaction
-Possible efforts to bring bill to floor
-Special revenue sharing bills
-Current situation
-Ford and Widnall
-Urban community development
-Manpower revenue sharing
-Education and Labor Committee
-Report on manpower training
-Minority efforts
-Rules Committee
-Manpower revenue sharing
-Educational revenue sharing
-Rural community development special revenue sharing
-Government Operations Committee
-Jurisdictional problems
-Agriculture Committee
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NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

Tape Subject Log
(rev. 10/08)



-David J. Seltzer
-Law enforcement revenue sharing
-Judiciary committee
-Poff
-Transportation
-Ways and Means Committee
-Trust fund
-Public Works Committee
-Jurisdictional problem
-Senate
-Law enforcement assistance
-Judiciary Committee
-Roman L. Hruska
-Urban community development
-Banking, Housing, and Urban Affairs Committee
-Tower
-Rural development
-Water and sewer provisions
-Hearings
-Proposals
-Education
-Jacob K. Javits
-Tunney
-Hearings
-Claiborne Pell
-House bill
-Transportation
-Commerce Committee
-National Railroad Passenger Corporation/American Track [AMTRAK]
-Winston L. (“Win”) Prouty
-Forum
-Manpower
-Labor Subcommittee
-Hearings
-Democratic proposals
-Finance Committee
-Welfare
-Health legislation
-Hearings
-Bills
-Edward M. (“Ted”) Kennedy
-General revenue sharing
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NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

Tape Subject Log
(rev. 10/08)



-Possible House action
-Government reorganization plan
-Government Operations Committee
-Hearings
-Action
-John L. McClellan
-Environmental bills
-Public Works Committee
-Water Quality Act of 1965
-Pollution dumping
-Environmental financing
-Banking, Housing, and Urban Affairs Committee
-Finance Committee
-Noise pollution legislation
-Commerce Committee
-Hearings
-Land use policy
-Interior and Insular Affairs Committee
-Protection of mining areas
-Interior and Insular Affairs Committee
-Hearings
-Water conservation
-Interior and Insular Affairs Committee
-Pesticide regulations
-Agriculture Subcommittee
-Report
-Toxic substances
-Commerce Committee
-Draft bill
-Smith
-Kennedy
-John C. Stennis
-Michael Gravel
-Mark O. Hatfield
-Status
-Gravel
-Two-year extension
-Possible vote

Appropriations
-Senate
-Young and Bow
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NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

Tape Subject Log
(rev. 10/08)



-House activities
-Interior subcommittee
-Hearings complete
-Agriculture subcommittee
-Hearings complete
-Public works subcommittee
-Hearings in progress
-Defense
-Prospective hearings
-Transportation
-Labor
-Department of Health, Education and Welfare
-Department of Housing and Urban Development [HUD]
-Others
-Allott
-Holdup
-Foreign aid
-Education bill
-Clifford P. Case
-Philip A. Hart
-Defense
-Prospective cut
-Allen J. Ellender
-Meetings of committee chairmen
-Michael J. (“Mike”) Mansfield
-Prospects
-Harold E. Hughes
-Selective Service
-House
-Supplemental budget
-Total estimate
-Funding levels
-Foreign aid reduction
-Patman
-Banking and Currency Committee
-International Development Bank
-Third National Bank
-Summer youth program
-Amount
-Bill
-Timing
-Fiscal Year 1971 budget
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NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

Tape Subject Log
(rev. 10/08)



-Amendments
-Debt limitation
-Fiscal Year 1972 budget
-Limitation on Congress
-Other bills
-Labor bill
-Agriculture, Treasury, Post Office Departments
-Department of Interior
-Department of State
-Department of Justice
-Department of Commerce
-Department of Public Works
-Department of Transportation
-Department of Defense
-F. Edward Hébert
-Foreign aid
-Reorganization
-Foreign Affairs Committee
-Dr. Thomas E. (“Doc”) Morgan
-William S. Mailliard
-Hearings
-Timing
-Extension of existing law
-Prospective bill
-Health program
-Interstate and Foreign Commerce Committee
-Health Manpower Assistance Act
-Health Maintenance Organization Assistance Act
-William L. Springer
-National Health Insurance Partnership Act
-Ways and Means Committee
-Calendar

Legislation
-House
-Reorganization of executive department
-Government Operations Committee
-Chet Holifield
-Proposed hearings
-Reorganization Plan No. 1
-Volunteer agencies
-Impact of outside organizations
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Tape Subject Log
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-Joseph H. Blatchford
-Peace Corps
-Foreign Affairs Committee
-Jurisdiction
-Ford
-Objections
-Timing
-Environmental program
-Bills
-Probable action
-Democrats
-Wayne N. Aspinall

Appropriations
-House
-Defense
-Military
-Foreign aid

Legislation
-House
-Ways and Means Committee
-Welfare
-Revenue sharing
-Health
-Environmental programs
-Revenue sharing
-Special
-Bills
-Experts
-General revenue sharing
-Opposition
-Public visibility
-Reaction of local governments
-Governors
-Democratic leadership
-Issue for Republicans
-President’s meeting with mayors
-Smith
-James H. J. Tate of Philadelphia
-Governors
-Warren E. Hearnes
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NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

Tape Subject Log
(rev. 10/08)



-Mayors
-Carl B. Stokes
-Patrick J. Lucey
-Effect of issue on Democratic Party
-Republicans
-Democrats
-Labor
-Tate
-Special and general revenue sharing
-Confusion
-Categorical grants
-Mayors
-Governors
-Popularity
-Democrats
-Distinctions
-General revenue sharing
-Timing
-Decision
-Congressmen
-Mayors
-Ford’s meeting with Peter F. Flaherty
-Need of legislation
-Bill
-Bipartisan moves
-Efforts by governors and mayors
-Mayors
-Richard J. Daley
-Unknown governor
-Mayor
-Tate and Flaherty
-Morgan
-Mills
-Tate and unknown mayor
-Community development revenue sharing
-HUD
-Water and sewer program
-Local governments
-Resources
-Communities
-Population
-Water and sewer grant
 29

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

Tape Subject Log
(rev. 10/08)



-HUD
-Standard metropolitan cities
-Standard Metropolitan Statistical Area [SMSA]
-Special needs
-Water and sewer grant money
-Federal objectives
-Special revenue proposals
-Exclusion of water sewage
-Proposal
-Small towns
-Importance to Republicans
-Counter arguments
-Applications
-Present proposals
-Republican interests
-Cities
-Importance to Republicans
-Unknown town in 1952 campaign

Republican leadership
-Support for President
-Smith’s statement on Lieutenant William L. Calley, Jr.

Anti-War demonstrations
-Need for firmness
-President’s policies
-President’s statement at Los Angeles and San Clemente, May 1, 1971
-Democrats’ positions


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BEGIN WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 1
[Personal Returnable]
[Duration: 38s ]


END WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 1

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 30

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

Tape Subject Log
(rev. 10/08)



-Present situation
-Democrats
-Demonstrations
-Decisionmaking process
-Vietnam
-Ford

Administration’s policies
-Demonstrations
-Vietnam
-Support for President
-Democrats
-Republican leadership

Democratic leadership
-President’s meeting in California with unnamed prominent Democrat
-House and Senate leadership
-Mansfield
-Senate
-Scott
-House
-Tradition of leadership
-Problems
-George H. Mahon and Mills
-Vote
-Power structure
-Republican minority
-Need for Republican unity in Congress
-Opportunity
-Absence of leadership
-President’s meeting in California with unnamed Democrat
-Republican control of House, 1946-1948
-Harry S Truman’s administration
-Thomas E. Dewey
-Republican national chairman Robert J. Dole
-Republican leadership in House and Senate
-Robert A. Taft, Jr.
-Arends
-Joseph W. Martin, Jr.
-1950 elections
-Mansfield and Carl B. Albert
-Republican leadership contrasted
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NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

Tape Subject Log
(rev. 10/08)




[General conversation/Unintelligible]

The President, et al. left at 10:04 am